[Music]
okay okay one sec let
me are you excited to do this
documentary not only I want to do it I
look forward to it can we ask about theg
murders yeah I'll you can ask me that
question and I'll reply okay we're just
going to put the Clapper board on there
okay the real serpent Charles Sage
interview take one good straight to the
camera my name is chancel bran many of
you may know me from the DV drama the
serpent but I'll do better the next I
have been accused of being a s killer
all my life this is a true story of
their
life no no oh the life and crime yeah
the life and crime what okay just a
second For the First Time The Serpent
Speak Out For the First Time The Serpent
speaks
out for the first time the serpent
speaks out you you got enough now to
edit there he
is life in the suitcase
what's it like to be a free man after
all those years in prison 19 years in
prison in the Paul I feel good yeah yeah
of course why are you doing the
documentary what what's Driven you to
this point no it mean I I have to
counter all those false uh accusation
allegations that
people made while I was in sight where a
lot of people say there many mysterious
things about your life Charles that
don't add up do you think in this
documentary we're going to unravel those
and then cover them and get to the truth
I can put forward my facts and my truths
and are we allowed to challenge those
facts and feted those truths without
hindrance yeah of course 100% you ask me
any questions I'm open you promise not
to obstruct us and getting the answers
absolutely not there's probably not a
single person watching this right now at
the beginning of this program who
doesn't think you're a serial killer how
does that
feel well there they have already been
been brainwashed by the
media that uh they say I'm Serial Killer
without knowing from where they took
that fact I wonder what if at the end of
this after these three or four months
they still think you're a serial killer
what will you do
then let's wait and see
first Charles saage convicted for fraud
International Car stealing passport
forgery armed robbery wanted in Turkey
for drugging and robbing in India for
Murder By strangling but has been linked
to more than 20 murders in Asia during
the 1970s young adventurous Travelers
were his victims for everyone Bangkok
was the natural Crossroad canet house
right in the center of Bangkok was a
very handy place for picking up tourists
and taking them back home he understood
drugs sedatives and tranquilizers and
use them as His tools of
trade
my body was a white girl was found
washed up on the beach in ptia what was
really going on between teres and
Charles in those four days I can't
answer the question maybe she was
drugged all that time a burn body of a
man has been discovered near payre as
far as I know he was knifed and also uh
hit on the head and he was burnt it
could have just been a thrill killing
Charles did seem to enjoy en what he was
doing a second Western girl has been
discovered on a beach near Paya they
discovered she had been covered in red
ants her dress was just up over her
face it is believed that the deaths of
Teresa nton Vitali hakeim Hank bintanja
and Cornelia hemco could all be
connected the one place where he was
tried India they failed to convict him
of murder but he was imprison for other
crimes for escaping India kept him 10
extra years in prison exactly enough
time to avoid extradition to Thailand
where he was wanted for five murders if
convicted there he would have faced the
death penalty released in 1997 he lived
in Paris where he was paid to give
interviews first is that whether I
committed murder did you the could have
decided
no I P trials I face
allegations and the cour they have de
IED I'm not asking you the legal
question I'm asking you the question of
whether or not you have committed murder
have you yeah but uh the cour have
decided that doesn't answer the question
does it yeah but that's my my
answer Charles sabrage is in London a
few weeks after being released from jail
in
Katmandu he's meeting the film crew for
the first of his interviews although the
murders and other crimes were committed
nearly 50 years ago his release has made
headlines all over the world he's
decided he wants to disguise himself to
avoid being recognized in public and
back in the 1970s he often used
disguises to con and Drug Travelers in
order to steal their passports money and
identities I took more than 10050
passports I will use maybe for one week
and change it you know once I took the
flight you know with a long hair mhm and
I put a lipstick lipstick like a woman
yeah yeah what would you do if someone
comes up to you though and says are you
Charles SBR say who is Char
much and if the person inist then I say
yeah I am let and then will you run away
of course
not I'm sure he or she will have a drink
with me up B do you like it when people
identify you do you do you like that
infamy no not at all you'd rather be
left alone
yeah when do you think you first used a
disguise the cloths didn't change the
men notice the beard
yeah not enough there we go Charles
Sage walking through the crowd not a
single person know we extraordin he's a
free
man I mean The Surreal thing is I normal
that looks on yeah I quite comfortable
so if you were doing a robbery or
targeting a victim or client as you call
them at a hotel meeting a clients in a
hotel but mostly 5 sou then I I'll put a
must is that why you were so affective
at it because you went un noed yeah I
believe so I was like a sh what would
you say to someone if they were to say
I'm really scared that Charles Sage is
in London he could do something bad to
me I will say they're free of their
feelings and thoughts what I'm doing in
this program without taking us through
any
Financial benefit I'm fed up of all the
allegations and and so I decide that I'm
going to put forward my facts and let
the people
[Applause]
decide in this series sabrage will have
his version of events challenged former
detectives will pursue all of the
existing evidence against him and a
forensic psychologist will conduct a
full psychological profile to determine
whether sub is a psychopath and remains
a danger to society over his lifetime
saage has been convicted of two murders
he remains the prime suspect in eight
others with his name associated with up
to 30 deaths yeah Charles S but this
investigation will focus on the murders
Sage is most closely connected
to so our experts will be looking at
accusations that you drugged murdered
and disposed of five victims in Thailand
1975 that's a lot of imagination yeah
please can I ask you a
question yes am I permitted to ask you a
question from where are you taking this
number you are
exactly as
many the victim of brainwashing by the
media I welcome to be confronted with
with those
expert only I I request
that confront me with the b in each
field the best
one and I will face them and they can
ask me any
question I will
reply right I'm just going to call
retired detective Chief Inspector Jackie
Mortin
yeah hi Jackie it's David oh hi David
how are you well I've got a very
interesting proposition but it's kind of
very
confidential okay um have you seen the
TV drama of the serpent oh my God I have
you I was hot absolutely hot well we've
got access to the the man who's the
focus of a child sabrage joking no he's
agreed to be
interviewed by a detective something
with which has never really happened
before and I thought of you and whether
you might be interested in it
wow Jackie's investigation into sage and
her re-examination of existing evidence
starts with one of the key sources
available to her a biography about him
published in
1979 in this book he confesses to a
number of
murders but the book came about because
Richard Neville and Julie Clark got hold
of SBR when he was in prison in
India and um offered to um interview him
with the promise of making a book this
book The Life and crimes of Charles Sage
that's how it came about so they would
interview him over a number of months
and take record those
interviews saage has been linked to up
to 30 murders and confessed to 10 but in
the years that have followed he has
retracted all of those confessions we're
going to focus on five victim was in
Thailand Teresa nson came from America
she was going to join a Buddhist sect in
uh kandu followed by Vitali hakeim
Turkish gentleman he had a girlfriend
called Stephanie Perry here we have Hank
Banger traveling with his girlfriend
Cornelia known as cocky these were a
Dutch couple you have crme seen photos
there is it important to show them it's
important to show them because we talk
about death this is the reality of death
they were live and vibrant young people
sadly these victims have been forgotten
but we are going to not forget the
victims in this program now in this book
there is a mass of detail for each of
those murders as to how he met them how
he conveyed them to the deposition site
what did with the bodies and that detail
is only known by the
killer yeah hi Jackie is David yeah
sabrage has agreed to meet you okay I
think he wants to sess you out really I
mean so could you be available
Monday or Tuesday of next week yeah I
can do
that who is Charles SBR who do you think
you well that question I can reply it is
to the people to reply to that yeah but
if somebody asked me who I am I would be
able to tell you or anybody else my life
is so complex that it's a difficult
question to reply so I leave that to
the to the public okay did did you rob
people robbing yes I did did you drug
people yeah I did did you take their
passports I did when you were
interviewed for the book there are
confessions to a number of murders which
you say you didn't do were you not
concerned about the ramifications that
could lead you to subsequently okay here
let me
explain
Richard nil he said you don't worry
because I will write that it is
alleged or suspected when you read and
when the book was released I read it
then at that time what I did I called n
I'm sorry to use this world I told nil
you mother
[\h__\h] you told me so and so but you
wrote In the book that that thing
I want to show you some photographs of
people and I want to if you can remember
whether or not you met them this is a
picture of Teresa Nolton did you ever
meet her I cannot say that I met her or
I didn't meet her what I want to do is
ask you whether or not you have met this
man Bali hakeim Turkish man do you know
him that no I don't know him never met
him do you know and in this case may
Madame the police themselves they stated
in the in their F in the Indian
court that the father came before the
police commission and stated that my son
is
alive did you have his
passport did you have his passport no I
didn't have his passport you've never
met him before yeah okay this person
Stephanie Parry is a friend of Vali
hakeim did you meet
her no I don't remember having met her
you've never met her because again I
repeat I have so many customers sure
this is the photograph of
henriquez and his girlfriend Cornelia
known as cocky do you know
them well I don't remember the
faces they so long but these cou I met
them first in Hong Kong and when they
learned that I was a gems dealer I told
them I gem dealer then they wanted to
buy some gems what were the gems that
they were interested in I don't remember
you are asking something of 50 years
more than 50 years lat the thing is
Charles that you have a very good memory
about certain things very good memory
but on other things when I put it to you
your memory Fades your memory Fades no
he's not fil I see
exactly the fact it has faded because
you gave them your visiting card they
came to see you they bought to buy some
Stone they but you are telling me which
Stone I I cannot tell you but like I
said sometimes I'm going to
suggest stive memory that question
you're asking me nobody me before what
can of stone the bo nobody this is the
first
time okay so how long did they how long
did you meet them for how
long I met them I think when they came
to me maybe they spent 20 minutes half
an hour and then only after that it was
I think the next day then they say that
oh that couple they were a little bit
sick and they offered them to stay in
the second
apartment okay yeah do you know what had
made them sick had you given them a
drink no I didn't do you know what
happened to them after he told you they
were sick did they recover I learned
only that two days
later they were not there they left this
book Speaks now let me just do a little
bit of talking here because you do a lot
of talking if you don't mind me saying
Charles what is very very difficult to
understand is why anybody
anybody there intell no you let me
finish please if you let talking hey let
me explain you let I ask you the
question Charles let me ask you the
question somebody as intelligent as you
why do you implicate yourself in this
book and how you met these people all of
these people Teresa okay but why would
you implicate now let me please ask the
question why would you tell somebody for
$20,000 and sell your soul why would you
sell your soul for
$20,000 why I C my
relationship my relation after with Rich
want the book
appear because I didn't agree to what he
wrote Madam I have told you already that
I you said no let me just ask now it is
to you to believe me listen I am telling
you my part now it is to you to believe
me or not believe
me yeah it is Madame yeah don't get too
excited you don't let anyone speak h i
don't you don't let you don't let me
speak she got so much to say no yeah
because you don't let me speak
listen hey hey no please please my story
is so complex if you ask me a question
which is a very important
therefore as you have asked me if you
didn't ask me I would not explain we're
going to run out of time now so let me
thank you for your time appreciate you
talking to me and uh let me go away and
make some inquiries as they say
okay so Jackie how do you feel that went
that's been a long afternoon I feel
absolutely exhausted and
drained he's a very very complicated man
he's highly intelligent
he's very plausible um he does want to
control the narrative I found if he
doesn't like the kind of question that
you might be asking he seems to go off
on a tangent and I found him a little
bit
dismissive of those people that did die
whether he's done it or whether he's
not sa's criminal career began young he
was a disruptive and when his parents
hotand and langang separated he was
shuttled between his father in Vietnam
and his mother in France where she lived
with her new husband an army officer at
9: he was sent to a Catholic boarding
school in Paris bad behavior in the
school room escalated to misdemeanor on
the street throughout his teens he was
repeatedly arrested for theft and
incarcerated for robbery at this time he
was effectively disowned by his
family on a spring day in the south of
France a 50 53-year-old man named
Charles Sage returned to his boyhood
home in Marseilles no one was there to
greet him my house is just over here
over the world wor still when he made
his way to the house where he grew up
and where his mother still lives she
refused to see him is it difficult for
you well yes because I wanted to see
her while sabrage has always said his
father was a good man he continues to
claim he was always denied his mother's
love why do you think she was like
that when the person is like that you
you you can ask her why she is like that
would she like it with the other
children no almost the same she was a
very selfish woman yeah selfish
woman but she's not well is
she well she she's she's now 100 year
old 100 yeah
she lost so much weight that she's like
a skeleton
mhm paralyzed mhm she didn't speak now
much she can why is that because I think
she lost memory mhm and does she
recognize you
now that I cannot see no
no so we've got the saage family photo
albums here so what we'll do first so
we're just just going to look through
the photos and just talk through Charles
what do you think when you look back at
these old photos well uh look at that
photo there look at that smiling happy
smiling boy that's a very happy boy
there isn't
it oh no even if you are in the
environment that you you don't like at
times you you'll have some um some good
moment H yeah who who are these yeah my
my mother mother she's a b here she
become old already yeah I think she was
about 50 here 50 yeah here more about
60 this photo from Vietnam yeah your
mother okay what was she like did she
like her appearance was she proud that
she was attractive she knew she was
attractive she was
beautiful this is interesting now look
at
this that's that's the many faces there
of the young Charles
Sage if you could talk to that young man
today if you could talk to yourself
today what would you say to him what
would you say to this young
man knowing what's happened to you in
your life what would you say to him I
don't know nothing you don't know no I
never thought about
that your question is unexpected
question
let us say that I could have been
something some someone
else yeah that young men could have been
someone else than what I am or I have
been
through by adolescence sabr was a
teenage delinquent when he was released
from prison at 19 he committed an armed
robbery and was sent to Bazi jail one of
the toughest in France during this time
he continued to be shunned by his family
so you didn't have any visitors where
was your mother why didn't she visit
you well most lik she didn't
care yeah she didn't care about you yeah
she she was I believe that kind woman
and what effect do you think that had on
you so I I've shut myself
on and therefore there was no
effect I I just shut
myself do you love your
mother no so I'm going to ask you now if
we were to introduce you to a
psychologist would you speak to him
honestly about your life yeah of course
and you wouldn't shut down you'd be open
open absolutely he can ask me any
questions and I reply to any
question Paul Britain is a leading
forensic psychologist he has Decades of
experience interviewing serial killers
and assisting the police in high-profile
murder investigations such as that of
Fred and Rose West the plan is for him
to join the investigation to produce a
psychological profile of sabrage and to
determine if he's a dangerous psychopath
hello hi Paul it's David Howard how are
you hello David I'm okay thank you um
we're um making a documentary about um
an alleged serial killer called Charles
saage this is the first time he's opened
himself up to this form of scrutiny by
somebody from your profession and I
think it'd be fascinating for television
but also I think it'd be fascinating in
a wider sense I I think we might
actually learn something I think You' be
the person for it because your
experience and your background well
there are two questions that I would
have
and it's who are you and then how did
you get to become who you
are hello I'm B Britain I've heard all
manner of different things about your
life and times and put those to one side
what I would like to do is to explore
with you what the truth is what the
reality is will that be okay absolutely
good you can ask me any question fine
that's really kind it won't be any
question which will make me
uncomfortable oh um when you were at
home with your mother's home the
stepfather's home what was the situation
what was the relationship like it was so
long I I I don't remember I I can tell
you only what I remember that my going
to my father every day almost almost
every
day let me stay with this for a little
while please you seem to be saying
saying that you have no
recall of your relationship no the only
recall I had that anyway that Obsession
to go every time to my father M and
rejection of the family I was in you
mean of my stepfather yes and my mother
it is the case that from time to time
people have traumatic experiences in
earlier times in earlier life and one of
the ways that they deal with it is they
drop shutters they can't remember I take
your point now do you then maybe that
certain part of my
childhood who was not I mean uh good so
maybe my mind has blocked it if you
wanted someone to help you to open those
doors is it something you'd want or
would you like just to leave it the way
way it
is to say frankly
I've never been interested to open that
door right fine I understand that if you
then ask me the question myself I would
have never thought about that I will not
think about
it right I do you ask me a question I'm
grateful for that so are you saying and
something which I've closed since a long
time yes yeah does that mean then that
your mother does not exist in your life
even though she's now nearly 100 she was
and she's you may say she was because
now 100 year old she's not so much
conscious now I understand yeah a very
very selfish
woman and did that hurt you it did how
have you coped with that I've never
thought about that I'm not
event thinking about
that and only the the question question
is that whether I forgive my mother or
not and they also the way she was even I
cannot make myself forgive her may I ask
you to do something for me
please I ask people in exactly the
position that you're in now if they
would talk to a person in their lives
with whom they have this difficult
relationship and I'm going to ask if one
of our colleagues would put a chair here
and I'm going to ask if you would
imagine your mother sitting in the chair
and I would like you if you feel able to
say to her to the chair even though
she's not there what it is that firstly
comes to your mind what you are now
asking yes it is something very intimate
it is very personel it is and it is a
choice if the person want to speak in
front of camera or to the people yes
right that thing yes it is and I don't
think it's the business of anybody so so
of course not you prefer not of course
having said all of that there is
something that you might say to your
mother you might want to ask her that is
so intimate your word intimate so
painful that you do not wish to say it
to me here now I have no reason to say
it to you I have no reason to say to the
public because it's in front of camera
yes this is very private yeah and we
have a right to privacy of course of
course yes you are asking about my
actual Family Life on yeah so this is
also a very private matter which I don't
want to
speak to talk about is that one that you
don't want to talk about with a camera
running or at all at
all do you
accept that people including me will
find themselves thinking of possible
reasons for that and if you do do you
care well if the people find any reason
for that I will tell them think whatever
you want yeah and is is that at the
moment your fixed position yeah okay
we'll leave that there then for the
moment okay thank you very much indeed
please saage met and married his first
wife in Paris at the age of 23 she was
alleged to become the first of many
female accompli in his criminal
lifestyle we used to come here like a
romantic SP
before our were marriage and after too
so what was she like I found her
beautiful intellectual that was the
attraction instant was she like wow yeah
I believe it was instant yeah does
anything ever keep you awake at
night sometime something keep me awake
yeah thinking about the
future and making plan for the future
yeah and making sure not to make a
mistake again no more mistakes yeah no
more going to prison yeah no more crime
nothing do you consider yourself to be
an immoral
man
well I did
wrong I I did something wrong I have
recognized it I have admitted
it I did wrong to some
people and those wrong were yes
immoral but I didn't go to the extent of
killing
anyone would you honestly tell me if
you'd kill someone yeah I would have
told
him and you didn't kill any no I didn't
kill any not one single person
no
throughout his early 20s saage continued
to be in and out of prison but at the
age of 26 his international criminal
career began in Earnest his wife became
pregnant and the baby was born while the
couple were on the run the infant was
sent to live with her grandparents in
France and a spree of thefts and
robberies that began in Paris continued
across Europe and
Asia the couple were eventually
imprisoned in Kabul in Afghanistan for
not paying a hotel bill
but just Weeks Later saage escaped after
drugging the guard's
tea he abandoned his wife in prison and
headed to France where he was determined
to reclaim his child from his
mother-in-law I decided anyway I was
going to take my daughter then I gave
her tea with something inside and she
fall
sleep then I took my daughter I put her
in the car and I drove to he border to
qua on the long Overland Journey to the
Border saage picked up a young solo
Backpacker Dutch teenager Georgina Nunes
in the weeks that followed she would
become witness to what is believed to be
his first
murder oh hi David it's Jackie how are
you do Jackie all right yeah I've got
some good news actually I've been doing
um a bit of digging and um I actually
spoke to Georgina NZ and what's even
better news is that she's willing to
come to London and be interviewed oh my
gosh that's amazing because you know if
if she pans out to be telling the true
story Georgina and NZ way back in 1972
you decided to leave your country in
Holland and travel to Asia mhm how old
were you in 1972 I was 18 years old I
wanted to be free like all the hippies
at that time I wanted to dance to have
music drugs so I decided to go where
everybody went to
Kaa Goa was a key stop on the so-called
hippie Trail of the 60s and' 7s
thousands of young Backpackers passed
through in search of
Adventure saage saw them as easy targets
robbing them of their passports and
money despite his veneer of charm
Georgina was suspicious of
saage when I met Charles I thought it
was very unusual because there were all
these hippies and I go like this is
unusual you would expect a businessman
to sit with professional people but not
fit hippies one of the common
denominators that people say is that
this man has a sense of presence a
Charisma that is attractive to women did
you feel that yourself he was very
intense I had a nose ring in my nose and
uh he pulled it out and there was blood
and I go like what did he just grab hold
of that and pull it out mhm and did he
apologize for no his eyes had no emotion
in them they were like dead eyes and he
had to kill her stare you know joina
Nunes was soon terrified of saage and
she couldn't escape as he'd conversated
her passport constantly on the move they
headed for Pakistan where the car broke
down zabra claims he recruited a local
man to Commander a new vehicle which
turned out to be a
taxi in Pakistan I had one guy who was
from
Pisha his name was Fez I asked him I
need a car and qua is like a dessert
desert with the heat and everything so
what he did he came up with a car and we
have driven in the desert for about 100
km and it was a full
heat then he he said that you know the
driver is I put him in the back
then uh what he defense he say okay let
let me check how is the guy
inong he open I I came also and the the
guy he looked like
dead in fact he was dead he died of
dehydration because of the heat I didn't
feel that I was involved in that because
I'm not the one who took the car I'm not
the one who put him inside right and I
knew it only on the way that he told me
and did you feel sad that this man had
died yeah of
course and and especially that my
daughter was there I was feeling very
bad yeah Georgina's recollection of
events is considerably different having
earlier taken a ride in the same taxi
and she remembers its driver well what
SBR is saying is that FZ bought the taxi
and he had put the driver in the boot
nothing to do with BR yeah
right yes unfortunately he's a
pathological liar who was your driver he
was a Pakistani man he had a number of
children he was a very nice guy his day
was Muhammad what happened after that
well in the middle of the night uh
Charles came to to the place where I
stayed and he said the taxi is outside
your place and uh apparently he drove
the taxi but no Muhammad no Muhammad and
when we were driving he told me Mohammad
is in the lockage department and I said
but but why he said well because I want
to steal the taxi and I'm going to give
him just sleeping pills and then I'm
putting him at the side of the road and
then when he wakes up that's when
he'll notice he doesn't have a car
ha as the nightmare Journey continued
Sage prepared a syringe filled with a
sedative every few hours he would stop
the vehicle we kept on driving and he
kept on going to the back of the car and
he gave injections well what happened is
well finally I couldn't take it no more
so I also went to the back of the car to
check what he was doing and then when I
looked I saw poor Muhammad in a pool of
blood and I could tell that he was dead
and I flipped
out what did saage say at that point did
he he said
oh that's too bad uh maybe it was a
little too much sleeping pill I said
well no I told you before it's way too
hot the guy can't breathe in the back he
and plus of injections he you can't
killed
him what did he say to
that well haha he said that's just a
mistake an innocent mistake he said
don't you testify against me because I
will kill you when you testify against
me you never met a man called feest no
I've never met a man called
feest the lethal sedation of the taxi
driver was an early instance of sage
using drugs on his victims psychologist
Paul Brittain is Keen to further explore
the importance of drugs in the execution
of s's crimes over some years how would
you select how would you decide who you
would sleep in that way mostly I would
have taken uh what I I call those
victims yes but which I call let's say
clients to make it simple right but in
discussion may I stop you for and thank
you um because it's not an easy thing to
do you have used the term quite
correctly of victims and yes you
mentioned clients but the measurement of
dosage is quite a difficult
discipline and it's so easy to get it
wrong and that is something that must
have happened with you from time to time
well how do you deal with that nobody
has died from drugs from my drugs but
it's quite a a difficult Enterprise to
put yourself well the what what I did I
I read some phical books and then also I
try those drugs not on me on who on some
of the heppes that I ask okay because
they taking drugs I will then ask them
for example okay when you take seery
they do do that's okay take it and you
you tell me then I will look at my watch
so you use them as guinea pigs yeah
exactly okay we'll leave that there then
for the moment okay thank you very much
indeed
please even though he's nearly 80 do you
think there are signs there that suggest
he's still a dangerous
man this is a
man who
still believes that unless the world
those around him can provide what he
believes is his right he will find a way
to take it that's what I would
expect so
dangerous I would not want to say he's
not
dangerous hello hi Jackie is David hi hi
I've come into the possession of
something I think you're going to want
to listen to okay there's some of the ex
of the tapes of the original confessions
he gave to Richard Neville okay yeah so
they are coming your way all right
brilliant thank you very much okay bye
bye that said did you give me something
cuz I feel very
funny I'm sorry to to
you I think I have to do something
better then she said you're going to me
I said no I'm not going to something
better well you just can't believe that
arrogant and cocky and poor Teresa says
have you given me something because I
feel giddy no and then he said what you
going to do to me are you going to beat
me and he said no I'm going to do
something better to you I
mean it's almost like if I'm honest he
takes huge Delight of saying that in the
confessions huge Delight there is no
shame there is no remorse there's no
nothing it's just oh you know what I'm
going to do something better to you H
I'm going to kill
you I took one of his CLS I put on his
face and I gine on it as I'm going
running to the car because of course it
will be a big FL then that's um the T of
isn't it I put gasoline on his face he
put cover on his face set fire to it and
then he runs away and he goes whoosh and
oh that's awful do you think he's
showing off proud of it oh yeah
absolutely proud of it he thinks is some
form of gangster doesn't he that you
know to be feared actually so he's
definitely definitely showing off God
dear takes your breath away doesn't it
when you hear these tapes you can read
about it but when you hear his voice it
adds another dimension to
it see love
I hope all this stuff won't hang me one
day and he
laughs he laughs so something in Charles
sabrage feels that he's confident enough
to say to these people take
$20,000 for this book and then says I
hope this won't hang me H during what he
says in there does this make you even
more determined to get
him absolutely absolutely he needs to be
challenged and he needs to be challenged
with firm evidence and that siren
attention in this program to do that I
will get him I will get this